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Sony P41 Questions

 
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ko4nrbs



Joined: 13 Mar 2016
Posts: 5
Location: NE Oklahoma

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:29 am    Post subject: Sony P41 Questions Reply with quote

This is a link to the Service manual.
http://depreyswildlife.com/Mods/Sony%20P41/dsc-p41_p43_l2.pdf

I would like to start using 18650 Li-ion batteries with this camera for external power with no NiMh or Alkaline batteries in the camera. Can I safely use 3.7vdc as described below?

Referring to page 14 and 23 the FP-860 Flexible Board is where the Sony AC-LS5 AC Adapter plugs in (DC IN) Plug J001. It supplies 4.2vdc at 1.5 amps. It appears that connecting the 3.7vdc 18650 Li-ion battery to ACV UnReg 1 and ACV GND is best because normally 4.2 volts is applied there. I believe the ACV is referring to the AC Adapter voltage, correct?

It looks like Switch Q009 and Q002 are Normally Open switches. This makes sense because you wouldn't want the AC Adapter back feeding the batteries. It is not a battery charger and only supplies DC power to the camera. I think switch Q002 closes when you plug in the AC Adapter and switch Q009 opens. This also makes sense because in the Operating manual it says there is no battery information available when the AC Adapter is plugged in. My theory is that the BATT/XTXT connection works in conjunction with IC401 Front Controller to operate the switches?? This is an uneducated guess on my part? What does BATT/XTXT stand for?

IC001 the DC/DC Control regulates the various voltages required for the camera circuits. The battery's voltage is applied to DC Control Q006/007 and IC001 DC/DC Control through switch Q009. There are fuses in the circuit as well, F001-F004.

Thanks,
Bill
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vtech



Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 1264
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In general there are couple of things to keep in mind.
Going from NiCAD/NIMH to lithium is definitely a much better choice however when it comes to recharging the Lithium, there is a lot more involved than simply applying a DC across an exhausted lithium battery.
Your schematic indicates a simple nicad charging system NOT meant for Lithium. You may hear about "infopack" Lithium batteries which has a built in controller.
Overcharging a Lithium cell can easily cause the cell to explode and start a fire(as you have seen it in the news) while at the same time it must not be allowed to discharge all the way which can easily ruin it---hence the need for some sort of a controller or else you are gambling.

On page 13, the output from the adapter is DC as it enters the camera(marking it AC on the schematic is rather confusing as there are in fact adapters that supply AC from the output).
Q009 is the path for the raw DC from adapter back to charge the battery.
BATT/XEXT indicates "not ext battery".
While forward biasing Q002, it also raises the level at pin A7 of IC401 signaling raw DC input.
At the same time pin H8 of the IC401(pg 14) keeps a tab sensing the level of the BT901 battery and back through pin E4 of IC001 can regulate it's charge.
Unlike lithium, the charging scheme for NICAD/NIMH is not critical.
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ko4nrbs



Joined: 13 Mar 2016
Posts: 5
Location: NE Oklahoma

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:23 pm    Post subject: P41 Reply with quote

The 18650 batteries will be charged in a charger made for them before I use them with the P41. I have no intention to use the AC Adapter. The P41 will be used as a Game Camera modified for that purpose. It will be deployed in the outdoors for long periods of time.

I guess I'll give it a try and see what happens.

Bill
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ko4nrbs



Joined: 13 Mar 2016
Posts: 5
Location: NE Oklahoma

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vtech wrote:
In general there are couple of things to keep in mind.
Going from NiCAD/NIMH to lithium is definitely a much better choice however when it comes to recharging the Lithium, there is a lot more involved than simply applying a DC across an exhausted lithium battery.
Your schematic indicates a simple nicad charging system NOT meant for Lithium. You may hear about "infopack" Lithium batteries which has a built in controller.
Overcharging a Lithium cell can easily cause the cell to explode and start a fire(as you have seen it in the news) while at the same time it must not be allowed to discharge all the way which can easily ruin it---hence the need for some sort of a controller or else you are gambling.

On page 13, the output from the adapter is DC as it enters the camera(marking it AC on the schematic is rather confusing as there are in fact adapters that supply AC from the output).
Q009 is the path for the raw DC from adapter back to charge the battery.
BATT/XEXT indicates "not ext battery".
While forward biasing Q002, it also raises the level at pin A7 of IC401 signaling raw DC input.
At the same time pin H8 of the IC401(pg 14) keeps a tab sensing the level of the BT901 battery and back through pin E4 of IC001 can regulate it's charge.
Unlike lithium, the charging scheme for NICAD/NIMH is not critical.


So where do I connect the + and - voltage coming from the Li-ion battery? I'm confused about what to connect to BATT/XEXT?
Thank you,
Bill
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vtech



Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 1264
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure why you are not using the same BT901 battery terminals?
Using the adapter Jack necessitate another step. You would need to know the potential at XEXT. (suppose you can measure it while hooked up to an Ac adapter?). In the older days, the "ext" signal was either a tie to Plus or minus line.
Looking at the diagrams, there is not enough info to determine that.
Ever since of the modular designs, Most of the details have disappeared.
Ie, If Q002 was a NPN, then you would at least need .6V at it's base for it to close, therefore requiring a presence of voltage at EXT coming from adapter...

The only sure way is to hook one, power up and measure the XEXT in reference to the ground.
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ko4nrbs



Joined: 13 Mar 2016
Posts: 5
Location: NE Oklahoma

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

vtech wrote:
Not sure why you are not using the same BT901 battery terminals?

I was going to but was concerned the voltage increase from 3vdc to 3.7vdc would damage the circuitry. Any idea if it would?
Bill
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vtech



Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 1264
Location: USA

PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I understand, the original NiCAD?NIMH battery that goes to BT901 is rated at 3 volts?
Wanted to clarify that It has nothing to do with button batter BT001. right?

I don't see how .7v difference would be a problem as both BT901 and J001 are shown as "UNREG" meaning unregulated which denotes raw levels that may not be precise.
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